Big problem with combat sims -

Cas141
Posts: 67
Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2002 5:00 am

Big problem with combat sims -

Post by Cas141 » Wed Feb 15, 2006 2:57 am

There are several posts from combat fliers who are having problems with 6DOF and shooting their planes guns on target.
It seems 6DOF misaligns the sims' gunsights.
Quote from CFS 3 forum at SimHQ.
"I have concluded , having now got BOB 2 and finding the same problem in there also, that 6DOF is not compatible with hitting the targets using the plane reticles and gunsights in the sims I am using 6DOF in.
It seems that a toggle button has to be used to switch trackIR off before firing.
Oh well....

I will post this at trackIR forums also "

Trackir - because this happens in a number of sims, it seems to be putting the ball in your court.
Have you any solution or comment to help us please?

borton
Posts: 16
Joined: Sun Feb 08, 2004 5:00 am
Location: England

Re: Big problem with combat sims -

Post by borton » Wed Feb 15, 2006 3:05 am

I posted this on the Wings of Victory forum which nobody seems to be looking at.

quote: I am a bit concerned that nobody from NaturalPoint has attempted to answer the abnove problems.

I do, however, have several of my own which have led me to switch off Vector Expansion.

1. When 3d starts, the view can be anywhere and has to be re-centred manually using the TIR centre hotkey.
2. After looking around and particularly after trying to follow a turning enemy, I have to manually re-centre ad nauseam.
3. When I have the enemy in my sights, I have to switch TIR off completely in order to re-centre the reticule in the gunsight.
4. If I look any where other than dead ahead, the reticule 'floats' around both in and out of the cockpit.

If I switch VE off completely within the game, then all of the above problems go away. True, I can no longer 'zoom' backwards and forwards, or peer along the outside of the aircraft but it is worth it.

It seems that I still have to wear the special fitting on my cap to make 2dof function. If I turn my cap round, to use the reflector on the back band, TIR fails to function at all! Can't fathom out this one. I think it is necessary as I get a brief 'split' screen as I look left/right.

I have Pro3. Please don't tell me I need TIR4. I won't buy it because as soon as I do, you will announce TIR5!

Automatic update check tells me I am using the latest version of your software.

Chef-Scott
Posts: 11
Joined: Tue Sep 20, 2005 5:00 am

Re: Big problem with combat sims -

Post by Chef-Scott » Wed Feb 15, 2006 4:03 am

quote:Originally posted by Cas141:
It seems 6DOF misaligns the sims' gunsights.
Sort of like real life then huh? Think about it. In real life you shift to the extreme left of the cockpit, your gunsight is now on the right, shift to the extreme right and it is now on the left. Lean too far forward and the gunsight is not centered properly with the "line of fire", same happens when you lean back. The gunsight is in a fixed position, it does not move around with you.
Just my take on this.

borton
Posts: 16
Joined: Sun Feb 08, 2004 5:00 am
Location: England

Re: Big problem with combat sims -

Post by borton » Wed Feb 15, 2006 8:48 am

Chef-Scott I appreciate what you say. Unfortunately, the Spitfire reticule will never centre, wherever you position yourself. The Hurricane aint so bad.

Rick, I am using your standard hat with the clip affixed to the peak. The reflector at the end of the peak is covered with black insulating tape. When it's worn this way round, the Tracking window shows the required triangle. If I turn the VE option off within WoV BoB2 and reverse the hat, so I am showing the single reflector on the adjustable band, the Tracking window shows that TIR is receiving but with a single reflection. However, in the sim the green On led will not function and neither will TIR.

If I turn the hat back round so that the clip is now showing, the led light comes on and TIR works.

I use the hat with the adjustable band to the front with TIR on BoB1 BDG 0.98, on another computer, and that works fine.

I can see no obvious reason why it will not work with the hat reversed in WoV.

[ February 15, 2006, 03:49 PM: Message edited by: borton ]

Toady
Posts: 94
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2006 5:00 am
Location: Cornwall, UK.

Re: Big problem with combat sims -

Post by Toady » Wed Feb 15, 2006 9:49 am

Hi borton.
It strikes me that if you go from vector to dot in game your TIR game profile will still be set for vector.
If thats the case the TIR wont respond and neither will you get a green light until the profile gets reset.

rodom
Posts: 581
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2005 5:00 am
Location: Philomath, OR

Re: Big problem with combat sims -

Post by rodom » Wed Feb 15, 2006 5:47 pm

Can you display what your tracking window shows at the time this is occurring? Are you using the clip with the Track Hat or a different hat? If using the Track Hat and the clip be sure to cover the embedded reflector or it will cause issues similar to what you are having.

Cas141
Posts: 67
Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2002 5:00 am

Re: Big problem with combat sims -

Post by Cas141 » Thu Feb 16, 2006 1:47 am

I am using a trackir hat, with the clip,of course.- and like Borton, I have the black insulating tape over the rim.
I haven't tried it turned around.
Perhaps, Rick, you could comment on Chef-Scott's "take" re the reticle imitating real life .
I haven't seen a RL reticle etc so i don't know, but am i to assume, C S ( and anyones else) that whereever the reticle is, if i aim so that my eye and the reticle are on target that i should hit it?

I.e. the target is at 2 o clock and I see it and line it up, from my position via the reticle, then i am on target if i fire? ( Allowing for lead etc )

Whatever- when trackir is switched off, the target is a lot easier to hit!!

Shouldn't be like that, should it?

borton
Posts: 16
Joined: Sun Feb 08, 2004 5:00 am
Location: England

Re: Big problem with combat sims -

Post by borton » Thu Feb 16, 2006 7:58 pm

Absolutely, Cas141! I take it that the reticule was projected on to the gunsight plate. If so, it should not move about when you do.

I've solved the problem of TIR not functioning with my hat turned round. Don't ask me how - it has just decided to work now!

Vector Expansion will remain switched off on my system. Definitely not suitable for Combat Flight sims!

Cas141
Posts: 67
Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2002 5:00 am

Re: Big problem with combat sims -

Post by Cas141 » Thu Feb 16, 2006 9:04 pm

Yes, I have turned the hat round and i use the profile with the dot and not the vector expansion, ie like the old trackir before 6DOF.
There is no doubt Rick that shooting in trackir, like it used to be, is better than shooting in 6DOF.

What would be ideal is a button to hit so that just before shooting starts you can hit a joystick button, which takes you from 6DOF to what Borton and I are now using.

Can that not be programmed in future software, or is the three points on the front of the hat a problem for "old" style trackIR?

cheers

rodom
Posts: 581
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2005 5:00 am
Location: Philomath, OR

Re: Big problem with combat sims -

Post by rodom » Fri Feb 17, 2006 3:44 am

quote:Originally posted by Cas141:
Yes, I have turned the hat round and i use the profile with the dot and not the vector expansion, ie like the old trackir before 6DOF.
There is no doubt Rick that shooting in trackir, like it used to be, is better than shooting in 6DOF.

What would be ideal is a button to hit so that just before shooting starts you can hit a joystick button, which takes you from 6DOF to what Borton and I are now using.

Can that not be programmed in future software, or is the three points on the front of the hat a problem for "old" style trackIR?

cheersSo basically you would want a button that disables all axes except YAW and PITCH? And once those are disabled, center them?

[ February 17, 2006, 10:45 AM: Message edited by: NaturalPoint - Rick ]

Post Reply