forums.naturalpoint.com

Hi. I'm seriously interested in buying a TrackIR4 Pro for flightsims (and possibly FPS's).

I have some questions/suggestions:

1. At naturalpoint.com's checkout, it states "UPS Expedited Air to Canada (handling fees included) is $31.54", but then, "Shipping and Handling does not include GST, Duties or other Taxes and fees that may be required by your country's customs. " ?? Normally, it's UPS that is gouging Canadians by charging horrendous brokerage fees at the door which make any GST (7%), duties or taxes pale in comparison. Would you consider offering any alterrnative shipping methods like FedEx or USPS? or even the post-office.
2. If I buy from http://www.cwonline.com in Toronto - foregoing import taxes, will I have the one-year warranty on a new TrackIR4 Pro?
3. If warranty is voided and I have a problem, ... is my "customer support" limited to these forums and email support only?
4. For "out-of-warranty" products, what is a price-range for typical repairs to TrackIR4 systems? (Hopefully, there are few! )
5. Why is www.extremegamingdevices.com allowed to charge SO much for your product? The Canadian dollar is not worth 65 cents US anymore.
6. Have you considered expanding your dealership in Canada?


I live in Saskatoon, SK, Canada where extremegamingdevices.com has their office. Your "Dealer" page implies they are the only "authorized" dealer listed in Canada.

Normally, I'd be thrilled, as I could save some money ($15 USD) on shipping and just go pick it up. However, with the Canadian dollar climbing past 85 cents U.S., (+ accounting for all the other variables stated on their website) the price from buying "locally" is astronomical!

I've worked out the math (including shipping, possible duties, taxes, etc.):

A. Direct from Naturalpoint's site:
$179.99 USD + ~$31.54 UPS shipping (includes "handling/brokerage" fees... but possibly not other taxes??) = $212.99 USD (x 1.16 = ~$247.07 CDN + 7% GSTax
= $264.36 CDN (possibly more due to Canada Customs/UPS?)

B. Pickup-order from www.extremegamingdevices.com:
$239.99 CDN + 7%PST + 7%GSTax
= $273.59 CDN
or = $290.69 CDN (if $15.00 shipping was needed.)

C. www.cwonline.com (via eBay):
$169.00 USD + $10.00 shipping within Canada.
= $179.00 (~$209.18 CDN)
x 7% GST
= @223.82 CDN

!!!

We're looking at possibly a ~$50 USD difference there! Is that what a one-year warranty costs these days?

Thanks in advance for any input you can offer.
Sincerely,
Allan (a.k.a. Frumpus)

hmm... Let me look into this a bit further.

[ January 16, 2006, 12:20 PM: Message edited by: NaturalPoint - Rick ]

Hello,

To answer your questions:

1) We only ship via UPS to Canada.

2) Cwonline is not an authorized reseller of any of our products. If you did purchase from them then you would have a 1 year manufacturers warranty through us, though would need to send the unit back to us in the states for any repair/replacement work.
ExtremeGamingDevices is our authorized reseller and can take care of any warranty issues locally without the need to send the unit back to us.

3) All of our users are welcome to use any support methods we offer, including email, forums or phone regardless of where they purchased the unit.

4) Once your product is out of warranty then we look at repair/replacement options on a case by case basis.

5) ExtremeGamingDevices does not charge that much for our products. Please check out their Purchasing FAQ for a more detailed explanation.

6) ExtremeGamingDevices has been a reliable and dependable dealer of ours in Canada for many years and does an excellent job representing our products. They are in charge of the Dealers in Canada and we are very happy with their efforts.

If you have any further questions or feedback please feel free to post them!

-Kevin

[ January 16, 2006, 02:08 PM: Message edited by: NaturalPoint - Kevin ]

Thanks for your replies! I'm still puzzled though:

1. Whose "Handling fees"?
2. The One Year Warranty is STILL VALID even if bought through cwonline.com?

1.
There are two sets of "Handling Fees" referred to at the Shipping checkout page on Naturalpoint's site, the first being "included" in the $31.54 UPS price. Are THESE fees paid to Naturalpoint for "handling international shipments"?... or are these the brokerage fees which UPS pockets? If they are the ones UPS charges, then what extra 30% charges are being talked about lower on the Checkout page? If no more fees will goto UPS after the $31.54, then that's what I want to know.

If not... Have you considered switching courier services for Canadian shipments? (Perhaps the following has not been brought to your attention...)

I've read XGD's FAQ ( http://www.extremegamingdevices.com/faq ... aq.html#US ). I'm also painfully familiar with what UPS charges to Canadians in "hidden" brokerage fees - *normally specified only upon arrival at my door*. These often amount to 30-38% of the original cost of the item - on top of their stated shipping price. The trouble is, very little of this fee (perhaps 7-8%) is actual governmental "tax". UPS takes the rest. (FedEx and USPS's "brokerage fees" are at least stated up front - AND often much cheaper in the end).

For shipments entering the U.S.A., a customs law is in place so that if the value of the item is OVER $200.00 USD, then taxes/duty can be applied. Alternately, the "Canadian version" of that law has the price set at $20.00 CDN (about $17 USD)!! Above that tiny amount, duty (not usually relevant due to NAFTA), plus GST may be charged. Most Couriers act as their own broker on the buyer's behalf and will a) fill out the necessary form(s), and b) "front" any cost Canadian Customs may charge to let a shipment through without delay... To my knowledge, it is for THESE "expenses" that courier's are allowed to charge.

The trouble is that they can write their own paychecks regarding "Brokerage Fees", and unless they are clearly stated or inlcluded when calculating shipping (like USPS and FedEx), end-user customers will find themselves having to pay bigtime at the door. UPS looks cheap up front, but gouges in the end. Other couriers "seem" to have higher Canadian shipping costs initially, but don't mess around with charges at the door, making things simpler for the customer.

In short, couriers take advantage of a silly Canadian Customs law.
UPS "hides" the fee up 'til it comes to the door, then ransoms your package back to you in front of your face.

Optimally, our government would simply alter the law... and set a reasonable cut-off - like $200 CDN! That would clear up the much of the mess.

(Sorry for the rant; I've just paid hundreds of dollars too much to UPS, and wanted to educate to save others from the same fate. Most American companies I've dealt with aren't even aware the fees exist because the U.S. entry limit is $200.)

2.
One the other note, to confirm: THe TrackIR4 Pro's One Year Warranty WOULD still be valid (through YOU guys in the U.S.) should anything go wrong? If so, that seems normal enough. In other words it does appear that the $40-65 difference between Extreme Gaming Devices and cwonline.com... is for "ease" of warranty use.

Truly, I hope the discussion will be moot, as I expect your product will outlast the warranty several times anyway, right?

Thanks again!